I grew up in a reasonably liberal Orthodox Christian home, and I am Orthodox to this day. I don’t know if it has to do with my parents’ conservatism, or with their feelings concerning my choices and my right to choices, or even if they simply decided that because we were getting sex ed in school, it was unneeded at home, but somehow, they made the decision to refrain from having The Talk with me. To this day, I am profoundly grateful for that choice, as odd as it sounds – I don’t think I could face having that particular chat with my shy, quiet mother, or worse still, my traditional Greek dad. The thought is painful to contemplate! But I still had access to complete, accurate information (we had sex ed in school in grades five, seven, and nine, and I read most of the books in the public library on the subject).
It was never discussed in Sunday school, either (I suppose they assumed that our parents were talking to us about it), but I knew that devout Orthodox Christians were supposed to wait until marriage to have sex. It’s a choice that I question almost every day (with my boyfriend, you would too, believe me), but one that I know in the end is appropriate for me, at least for now. It is not a choice I wish to impose on anyone else, but I do wish that others would respect my right to that choice. Being as liberal as I am in most other aspects of my life, my friends are always stunned when they hear that I’m a virgin, and they immediately question my choice: have I not met the right guy, am I scared, is it a self-esteem issue, am I just not on birth control yet…?
I feel that this is an aspect of sexual education that is often neglected: it is absolutely crucial that every young adult receive accurate information about sex, contraception, STIs, pregnancy, abortions, and all the rest, but it is just as important that we make it clear that choosing to not be sexually active is equally valid, and not a sign of prudishness, close-mindedness, or conservatism. It’s just a different choice. I don’t question your choice; why do you question mine?
In my case, it’s a choice I made out of respect for my own body and out of respect for the person I eventually choose to marry. I’m still young enough to be a romantic at heart: I want my future husband to know that I loved him before I knew him, enough to save at least that for him and for us. I don’t know why others make the choices they do, whatever choices they make, but I respect them regardless. As expressions of sexuality become more openly accepted (and it’s high time they were!), the choice to refrain from such expressions needs to be equally accepted.
I plan to talk to my children about the importance of good, healthy, and safe choices, and about what those choices are, but I want to make sure that they understand that all the choices are equally valid. I can only hope that others will do the same.
–anonymous
Well, I tell you why I question your choice (it seems that nobody has pointed this to you): you will neither know yourself nor your loved one sexually. Practice makes perfect, yes, but you may fail to have the “chemistry”, and after marriage it is too late to go back.
If theory deserves, according with you, such a high value, why practical knowledge, through masturbation and a little premarital sex, gets that rejection?
How is that respect to the own body, a body made (among other things) for enjoying sexual pleasure, implies denying one of its most wonderful capacities?
I think that although you are mistaken, you can do what you want, of course. But don’t forget to tell your children about the complete point of view of those that oppose your way of thinking, otherwise they will hardly make a really free choice.
Oh, sorry, I forgot to sign the previous comment.
Anonymous has clearly stated that she respects other peoples’ ability to make their own choices on this matter. I think we need to give her that same respect.
I have clearly stated that she can do what she wants, so I don’t see why do you suggest that I am not respectful. I find it more respectful to point and discuss possible errors than to cheer up and leave the other one possibly mistaken. And from a selfish point of view, I may also change my mind and/or gain insight from the ensuing discussion.
but it is just as important that we make it clear that choosing to not be sexually active is equally valid, and not a sign of prudishness, close-mindedness, or conservatism.
Though I’m pretty much your polar opposite in my sexual life, Anon, this post spoke to me. One of the things that I’ve gained after having a lot of sex is a new appreciation for when you shouldn’t do it!
To clarify, I don’t think sex is bad, or having many sexual experiences is bad. I’ve just come to a new appreciation of how many factors (level of sexual education, the self esteem of your partner, similar sex drives, honesty about likes and dislikes) go into having good sex. And in the face of all that, I find it hard to think of any sex as “casual” any more.
It really spoke to me too. I tend to think everyone who abstains does it because of fear or mindless devotion to old-fashioned rules. That’s simply not true–and it’s a good reminder for me that generalizing is never very helpful.
I suppose I can’t prove that I am in fact the author (though I’m sure the admin will recognize the email address), but I do want to respond to the comments. (And thank you for thinking that this post was worthy of a comment!)
Molly, I’m glad to hear it! It’s strange, but hearing about my friends’ sexual adventures and misadventures makes me want to hold off longer in some ways. It has certainly made me acutely conscious of all the things that you have to consider when entering into a sexual relationship (along with all the things you tend not to consider) and this, in my experience, is not something that most people do. I would like to think that I can learn something from the mistakes of my friends, and I’m trying to do so!
But Eromante, that works both ways. I have married Orthodox friends who barely kissed their fiancés before the big day and they are paying the price now – in incompatibility, in lack of experience, in pure discomfort stemming from an inability to talk about sex. I don’t want that to happen to me, either. I do masturbate occasionally, and I’m quite aware of what I like and don’t like. As to what happens with my boyfriend…I’m not about to kiss and tell, but one does have options other than sex, and as we are healthy young adults, we do explore those. I just choose to walk a slightly finer line than most people my age. I don’t deny that our bodies are made for sexual pleasure, among other things – I just make different choices about when and how to experience that. I don’t consider it a denial; that would make me a nun, which I most certainly am not! And I’ll be the first to admit it: if things drag on long enough, I will probably change my mind. But I don’t think that my current choices will doom me to a life of sexual dysfunction. I refuse to allow that to happen. In any case, if you’re marrying someone, you should be able to talk about sex with them, and if I can’t do that, I’m not going to commit to them in that way.
And yes, I promise that I will tell my children that sex is not evil. (I honestly don’t think it is. I hope I’m not giving the wrong impression.) I will tell them that it is healthy and natural, but not to be taken lightly, and that they should act on whatever choice they make in an intelligent, responsible manner and in a way that respects their significant other. From where I stand, that’s the best and least biased way to put it. Can you offer any improvements?
Well, thank you for your post and for participating in the discussion!
You say that, granted that both of you will be able to talk openly about sex, you will be able to solve all your sex problems. Well, it may not be always true, but I agree that it is a good bet. I am also pleased that you masturbate, I find it more respectful to know yourself than to go for sex without a clue of what you like or not.
I see that you can make exceptions to your choice. You value sex enough to wait until being with the right person. That is something to be proud. However, waiting until marriage is having a bet that you can lose, because marriage is irreversible. If I were you, I’d have sex before marriage just to be sure :). Or maybe you consider divorce acceptable under circumstances not as grave as those required by the Orthodox Church. In that case, nothing to say.
Finally, I must say that your sex-education plans are unbeatable!
Yes, this is the post’s author. :)
Thank you for commenting here!
“In my case, it’s a choice I made out of respect for my own body and out of respect for the person I eventually choose to marry.”
“…but I want to make sure that they understand that all the choices are equally valid. I can only hope that others will do the same.”
See, this is the part that brings me up short. If you had said “…because I believe you should wait for marriage” or some variation of “personal choice, different strokes for different folks,” I would be saying some variation of “Good for you for knowing what you want, sing it sister, etc.”
Why? Because if you say “I believe that you should wait for marriage,” the obvious implication is that people who have sex before marriage DO NOT hold this belief. That’s cool.
If you say that you aren’t having sex because YOU respect your body, the obvious implication is that people who ARE having sex DON’T respect their body. That’s not cool.
I would actually be more okay with you making that statement (I wouldn’t agree with it, but hey) right up until you said that you want everybody to believe that all the choices are equally valid.
You have attached statements with value judgments to your personal choice.
If you sincerely believe that all choices are equally valid, then you need to work on your choice of words when you present that belief, because this post fell short of the mark. You need to use language that is respectful of others.
Instead of “because I respect my body,” try “because TO ME, respecting my body means not having intercourse.”
I don’t want to be misunderstoond, here. I don’t want you to think I’m attacking or disrespecting your choice. I’m not. What I object to is your use of loaded language while asking for people to believe that all choices are equally valid. What I hope is that, going forward, you will choose language that is more respectful of all choices.
A question for the author: you say “I want my future husband to know that I loved him before I knew him.”
What does that mean to you? It’s hard for me to understand how you could love a person before you know them- is it more that you love the concept of a monogamous partnership or something like that?
Also, would virginity be an important criterion for you when deciding who you want to marry? I.e. are you expecting your future husband to save sex for marriage as well? And conversely, would you expect that your future husband would place a high priority on your being a virgin? I guess I’m curious to what extent your belief in abstinence until marriage is a decision about yourself personally or about yourself as part of a couple, if that makes any sense. And I guess my first question kind of ties into that as well- is this about your love for your unknown future husband or is it about personal virtue? I’m not trying to condemn it either way, I’m just curious what is driving your decision.
Not to be nosy, but you say that you explore “options other than sex.” I think that different people’s different definitions of sex complicate this a lot. E.g. I have a friend who considered herself abstinent until marriage, but she’d had oral sex with a previous boyfriend. To me, oral sex is sex. And so is anal sex, and so is mutual masturbation. I don’t know of any good arguments for classifying those as somehow less than “real” sex, unless you’re specifically talking about reproduction. If you’re talking about closeness to your partner (or about potential for disease transmission), all those should be counted as sex, in my opinion.
For some reason I was immediately in support of the author of this post. Now I did not wait till I was married, not by a long shot. My wife of greater than 20 years did not wait either. I have had “some-to-many” sexual partners and my wife a “few-to-some” (specific numbers aren’t meaningful because they are different to each person reading but for a guide some is around 15).
We also have 3 children, all girls, with the eldest one nearly 18 and I do not think it is likely any one of them will wait but I am definitely not concerned as they have always made thoughtful choices so far.
So why am I in vehement support? Because its well written and just plain shrieks of honesty and sincerity.
The pulling out of sentences and dissecting them will always yield results that vary from the intent of the author. Sometimes by just a little and sometimes by a lot but the overall post for me is thoughtful and respectful and also provides a good counterpoint to some of my own opinions.
I especially liked the subtle way that the author indicated that she believes her choices now show respect and love not only for herself and her current partner but also her partner in the future.
Well thought out and good luck with your journey
I completely respect your right to your well-defended decision. What’s most important is that you are comfortable with it.
But I respectfully disagree with it — as others have and will disagree with any one you make about something as important as this.
When I was first married I had slept with one woman, my then wife. We divorced and I am now married to a woman who hadn’t had sex with anyone before she was first married.
Wisdom may or may not come with age, but we both regret not having experimented as much as possible sexually before first marrying. I have come to believe that adolescents should be offered a choice of having as much sex as they can safely and lovingly handle — I guess a pretty radical view I have to admit.
For example, surely teaching the joys of masturbation would be as safe and self-loving as I can imagine — not a requirement, but encouragement. And yes, I’m radical enough to say that *any* prohibitions against it might be mentioned, but not given any credence whatever. I think the ending of giving any credible reason for abstaining from masturbation is one of the great accomplishments of the boomer generation.
So, yes, good luck on your journey. May it be as a happy a one as it can be.
I loved your post. It’s not the route I took, but one I pursued (at least in part) until I was 18. I was adamant about waiting until I was 18 to have penis-in-vagina sex, and not a day goes by that I am not happy I kept that promise to myself. I experienced a lot of weird looks too – most of my friends lost their virginities one or several years before I did, and there was a decided feeling of “what’s wrong with YOU?” every time I mentioned I was still unicorn bait.
It’s easy to think that one’s take is the “right” one on any particular subject…this post left me struck with the same feeling I had when I watched “Mona Lisa Smile” with my niece a few years back – namely, that just because we have the right (or implied social permission, if that sounds better) to do something, it doesn’t mean that we HAVE to. Sometimes it’s liberating enough just knowing that we COULD, but CHOOSE not to.
I hope your marriage, and your marriage bed, are wonderful and fulfilling.
My wife and I are swingers and I have had sex with over 200 different women. Honestly, the more you have sex, the better you get at it. Mine and my wife’s love making skills got much better after we became swingers and started putting some serious notches in our bedpost. Our sex life was never bad, but after 10 years of marriage it was becoming routine. So we decided to go to a swingers club and check it out. We had a great time and have made some great friends and lovers along the way. If you truly love your mate what is wrong with them having sex with someone else? Traditionally after 10 years of marriage couples do one of three things: 1. Cheat 2. Just die sexually 3. Become swingers.
Life is short, have fun, get laid
This works for you and your wife, Dave, and for that I am truly glad.
But swinging is no more for everyone than is monogamy. It takes a very special couple to open up their relationship long-term (not for a few weeks or months, mind you). I’d not want to push anyone into it or even suggest that it’s the best way to manage a relationship.
After reading this, I’m curious about a couple of things.
I wonder what about having sex before marriage you find to be “disrespectful” toward your body? I imagine you are a person who would, when the time comes, have safe sex with someone you care about—so how is that disrespectful of your body if it comes before vs. after marriage?
You also said you wish to save sex for just you and your husband. What about sexuality makes you feel it is something to only share with just the person you marry, or what is your goal in only sharing it with your husband?
To be as honest as possible, I ask these particular questions because I see these reasons given by the religious right quite a bit, and I don’t believe they hold up. I can see many solid reasons for waiting (not the right person, not comfortable with a given act yet, just don’t feel like it, etc) . . . but as for the reasons you gave, I don’t know how well the logic bears out.